Pope Concerned Over Rosary Praying
Read on Rorate the transcript (unofficial and unauthorised; I wonder whether a dementi will follow) of the latest free-wheeling thoughts of a Pope for whom to think of something and to say it seems to be one and the same.
A group of faithful offers him more than 3,500 rosaries prayed for him. Think how beautiful and moving this is! Would you not be moved at knowing someone prayed one Hail Mary for you? When the Pope receives not 3,500 Hail Mary, but 3,500 rosaries he is not at all overwhelmed by the stunning beauty of this gift; instead, he takes it “with respect”, but he is also “concerned” at the practice.
The Rosary? Seriously? Do you think you live in the Forties? And come on, are you even counting?
Please visit Rorate and read there the entire text of the transcription; it transpire an atmosphere of mockery among the present, to which the Holy Father reacts by saying to them not to laugh, but clearly showing with his “concern” he thinks the same as they do, without the mockery.
For a Pope who goes around saying he is particularly devout to the Blessed Virgin, this is seriously beyond the pale. Actually, this is beyond the pale for anyone wearing a habit.
We live in times where, to put it mildly, what would be considered object of mild derision and cause of very sad reflections in a country curate comes from the mouth of a Pope with such astonishing frequency as to make it a part of everyday life, in the same way as the ramblings of the village stupid isn’t even noticed after a while.
In this case I don’t know about the village, but I don’t have many doubts about the stupid, because a Pope who has recently been publicly corrected about a fundamental tenet of Christianity – one that should be within the grasp of every catechised child – and insists in saying whatever happens to cross his not very well instructed or reflective mind without any problem perfectly fits the description. Can you imagine the Pontiff Emeritus talking like that? Can you imagine any Pope of the past doing the same?
And so we learn that to the string of pearls this truly astonishingly incompetent Pope has given us in less than three months another one must be added: don’t pray the Rosary because it’s so passé and for Heaven’s sake, don’t count them! I mean, do you think we are in the Forties?
I am now eagerly awaiting for the corrections or, ahem, “clarifications”, of the Lombardis and Rosicas of the world, explaining to us that the Pope is oh so very fond of the Rosary and by any means, feel free to count.
The worst of it is that the clarification might even not come.
What is cause for concern here is not the Rosary, but a Pope who is concerned about them.
My next rosary is for Pope Francis. I hope he won’t be too concerned.
Mundabor
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Posted on June 11, 2013, in Catholicism, Conservative Catholicism, Traditional Catholicism and tagged Pope Francis, Rosary, Vatican II. Bookmark the permalink. 25 Comments.
Mundabor's Blog 
I think you overstate your case. As I read the transcript, he was commenting on the attitude he perceived in the precise counting (and reporting of a precise number), not the praying of the rosary. You may disagree, but to misrepresent is unjust.
I notice you yourself rounded the number, rather than quote it precisely. Do we deduce anything from that?
You can deduce that, for technical reasons I do not have to explain to you, I cannot easily write with the text before me. But the fact I do not think it necessary to mention the exact number does not mean that I discount the rosary counting of those good souls; as, in fact, should be evident to anyone who reads my words.
You are also wrong in saying that his problem is merely with the counting. This is not only clear enough from the context, but it is also made very explicit from the words “and these groups return” to the end of the paragraph. You may want to read it again.
M
Our Holy Father denigrated Rosary Prayer as an outdated practice and, far worse, he associated such a practice – including the counting of the number of rosaries – with the heresy of Pelagianism which makes me question his grasp of that heresy.
This was very insulting to the Faithful who maintain that long-stading custom and pious practice and his bizarre statements are becoming a huge problem for the Church.
He is already clearly on record saying he desires a church for the poor but Jesus did not establish His church for the poor. Jesus came to save sinners; rich, middle class and poor. I never thought I’d see a Pope separate the Church by class.
The more bizarre are the acts of our modern Popes the more strident are the attacks of the conservatives on those who raise reasonable questions about those actions.
Dear Mundabor. I think you acted with measured reserve in this instance. What was said could justify a much stronger response.
This is a scandal.
I also wondered what is Pelagianism to do with all this.
I once had a rather dim Jesuit posting here, and also mentioning Pelagianism completely out of context.
I suspect Jesuits are trained to throw the word Pelagianism around whenever they want to criticise, in order to appear well trained in theological matters.
I agree with the rest in full. This thing of the “Church for the poor” neglect to say many saints were actually unmistakeably wealthy (think only of Thomas More), and the wealthy are still today, as probably also in Jesus’ time (Joseph of Arimathea must have been a great spender, or Zacchaeus; Matthew of course) a great source of income for the Church.
M
Mundabor,
I read the article, and seeing the Holy Father’s words, it was appalling. We have here a pope that is a complete modernist, and who apparently despises traditionalists. I then realized three things:
1) We are not getting the Latin mass back in this pontificate.
2) Pope Francis is going to slow down the process, and
3) Pope Emeritus Benedict is probably regretting his resignation right abut now.
Personally, I begin to think this Pope wants to be the popular guy and will therefore not have the guts to start an open confrontation with the Traditionalists. I rather think the slowing down will continue as it has always happened under Benedict, in the sense that the foot will be kept over the brake to avoid the acceleration of the TLM. No new impulse, but no open fight. I might be wrong. We shall see.
M
I also was pretty floored when I read this piece on Rorate last night. However, I thought this isn’t a transcript of what the Pope said ~ it’s just hearsay. Then this morning, it appears that Rorate has more confirmation that he did indeed say these things. I have such trust in Rorate’s integrity that I’m sorry to say that I guess the Pope did indeed say these things. Oh. My. Gosh.
He is addressing the “counting”. But he is also talking about the “old-fashioned practice” of offering Spiritual Bouquets basically. From this morning’s posting on Rorate:
“Why don’t they say, ‘we pray for you, we ask…’, but this thing of counting… And these groups return to practices and to disciplines that I lived through – not you, because you are not old – to disciplines, to things that in that moment took place, but not now, they do not exist today…”
Excuse me? They do not exist today? What doesn’t exist today? I can only take his words as meaning the offering of Spiritual Bouquets. I swear, this is way concerning to me. I feel like I just got kicked in the stomach.
I did not have any doubt from the beginning, because the style of the speech was so unmistakeably Bergoglio it could not have been easily invented.
M
Mundabor,
we already know that he regards traditional Catholics as “fools”. No wonder he thinks these fools are doing foolish things, such as praying the Rosary, celebrating reverent liturgies, believing the whole Faith, including the teachings on Hell, and other things that do not appear, shall we say, emancipated to your average neo-modernist Pope.
Well, at least Pope Francis speaks out constantly, clearly and forcefully on issues of morality, such as the defence of life and the natural familiy…
Oh, wait…
Do pray your Rosary for Pope Francis – he is in urgent need of help from the Virgin.
Maybe you should make it three Rosaries, though. Just so you have something to count… 😉
But seriously, I have just resolved to pray exactly 3652 Rosaries in the next ten years, including the 29th of February in 2016 and 2020. Up until now, since my conversion, I have been praying the Rosary sporadically, but never firmly establishing the habit of doing it every day, no matter what. I am writing this here, because I want to express my thanks to you for helping me realize the importance of the Rosary by your many posts on this matter (never heard anything about it from my parish priest, of course…).
The counting, though, I shall do especially for the Pope…
Many thanks for your kind words, Catocon, and I am so happy to have motivated someone to pray the Rosary every day. A great sign of predestination.
Your parish priest would, of course, have the same opinion of the Pontiff concerning the Rosary…
M
In America, we have a humorous Italian dialect song called “Whatsa Matta You?” When I hear the latest faux pas from Pope Francis, I feel like singing it, especially the line, “Shut up your face!” If the Pope can’t say anything helpful, he should be silent.
“Whatsa Matta You?”
Butta thisa isa fantastico! 😉
M
This is certainly unconscionable and truly astonishing but should we be surprised? This pope has nothing but contempt for anything of Tradition and traditionalism and to say otherwise would be fooling oneself. I’m waiting for certain neo-Catholic bloggers to pick up this story and tell us how we should be reading these words through Pope Benedict XVI…it is to laugh… but why do I want to cry? Usquequo Domine?
I am sure many will prefer to fool themselves.
It goes against their dogma of Papal Fuehrerprinzip.
M
Well, let’s face it, those Bead Tellers are a bunch of benighted bohunks who are superstitious; they never learned that God loves us just as we are and that we are saved and all of this hocus pocus obsession with the Mass and doctrinal precision and stuff is keeping us chained to the past and we left all of that pious junk behind at Vatican Two.
As for our future and how Pope Francis’ Church will be able to be distinguished from The Salvation Army remains to be seen as I don’t really think Our Holy Father is too keen on Salvation and The Sacramental System that is necessary to achieve Salvation.
I agree with you, vermontcranck1.
Come on, let’s do good.
Stuff the rest.
We are not in the Forties.
The Church will remain the Church, though. Even the more disastrous Pope is nothing more than a child scratching his fork on the Colosseum.
M
M
The “don’t laugh at them; pity them” attitude is painfully familiar.
Well, I shall include the Pope in my telling of the Rosary today.
We are not in the 40s. Can someone please remind Il Papa what the 40s were – at least outside of Buenos Aires.
I imagine that a lot of Rosaries were being prayed during that horrible and bloody decade.
Yes, those horrible times when people went through life, war, destruction and bereavement with a solid faith and fear of The Lord.
How very old….
M
Every new war is a new training ground. We always seem to be fighting the last war. We will figure out, if we haven’t already, that the war is ongoing, and we are called to be soldiers in this war. I thank you for your posts about the rosary, and the links. I’m a new convert, and this has been a difficult concept for a former Calvinist to grasp.
Jewel,
I dare to think for a former Calvinist this little effort is a (little) mine of information.
if you visit the “Catholic Vademecum”, you’ll find many posts about traditional Catholic practices (like Novenas, Litanies, & Co.) that are such an important part of our wonderful catholic patrimony, though the Pope seems to disagree and be concerned…
M
Mundabor, I checked out the Rorate link and found a link there to an article about the “Gay Lobby” with the Pope’s comments. http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2013/06/pope-to-clar-part-2-yes-there-is-gay.html I tried to share this on NCRegister.com, but got the message it has been “blacklisted”. Do you have any comments about this? Scary, real scary.
Yes, that was another of the many news of that day…
Not new to us, though…
M
I think I sneeked in a reference to NCRegister. They did print my comment with a shortened version of the link on their article “Obama Threatens to Veto Bill Protecting Soldiers’ Conscience Rights”. The article about the “Gay” lobby is further down the page. http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2013/06/ NCRegister tends not to allow certain references. Now they are actually reporting on the Pope’s reference (denying it had any substance, of course). Homos are ENTRENCHED in the Church, aren’t they?