On The SSPX-Vatican Agreement

The SSPX-Vatican agreement seems now (not for the first time, actually; and we know how it ended before) very near.

However, this time the situation is different, in that the Church is led by such a demonic, heretical, and bullying individual that some question (among them professor Roberto de Mattei) whether such an agreement is really the best way to go in the current situation.

I must say I am with New Catholic on this, and think that what is good in itself should be regarded as good irrespective of the circumstances in which this good takes place.

However, I have a number of caveats, which are the same I have expressed several times on this blog. They are as follows:

a) The agreement should be made from a position of complete mistrust, and actually utter contempt, for the Evil Clown.

b) Therefore, it should be structured in such a way that the assets and legal position of the SSPX as an institution are completely insulated from the paws of the ‘umble ‘eretic, Pope Uriah.

c) It should be (but of this I have no doubt) accompanied by the strongest desire to keep following the truth no matter what the Evil Clown says, or orders, or spits about. Finally,

d) it should be (but of this I have no doubt, either) accompanied by the firm resolution to be just as critical of FrancisChurch after the agreement as before.

The way I see it is this: you don’t refuse something good for Catholicism merely because it comes from a man who is bad for Catholicism. However, this clearly assumes that the agreement is such that the bad guy cannot hurt the good guys.

The agreement allows the SSPX to expand like a cancer in Francischurch’s body. This, my friends, is jolly good. 

What advantages Francis has in inviting this cancer is in my eyes not difficult to fathom. I see a maximum of three of them.

a) Firstly and most importantly, credentials of “tolerance”, which will allow him to push his heretical agenda even further;

b) perhaps, the suppression of Summorum Pontificum and of the FSSP and other traditionalist bodies as he would claim there is, now, a legitimate outlet for Traditional concerns;

c) also possibly, the attempt to bully the SSPX into submission like he has just done with the girls at the Cowards of Malta.

I see a) as the first motivator and the only realistic aim for Francis. I suspect the agreement with the SSPX would be followed by a “mercy offensive” that would see Kasperism more or less officially embraced. However, not the SSPX would have to answer for this, but Francis. Francis can attempt any and every heresy every day, and it is not realistic to demand from the SSPX that they should reject a historic victory out of a misplaced sense of responsibility for the evil actions of other people.

The b) scenario is, ultimately, possible with or without agreement, any day. Ask the FFI. But also here, I do not think the SSPX should have a set of genitals for themselves, another one for the FSSP, a third one for the institute Of Christ The King Sovereign Priest and other ones for the Papa Stronsay priests, etc. If these institutions are ordered to disband, it is their damn duty to refuse and go the way the SSPX did in the Seventies; protecting their assets as they can, but their integrity first. Once again, you can’t avoid a good outcome out of fear that cowards will accept to be bullied. Not even sovereignty was enough to allow the Cowards of Malta to resist, and this was a protection around ten orders of magnitude bigger than any SSPX “rebellion”. Cowards will be cowards. It is not the job of the brave to be held hostage by their cowardice.

The c) is, in my eyes, completely unrealistic. I doubt there are people outside the SSPX who distrust not only Francis, but the entire V II Church more than they do. They breath it, eat it, drink it every day. A priest who accepted to be suspended a divinis the day of his consecration isn’t likely (bar something very short of demonic possession or total loss of faith) to accept to be sodomised “in obedience” by the very people against whose heresies he vowed to fight the good fight for his entire life.  

Again, the SSPX are no  Cowards of Malta. This is Sparta. 

Heretics will be heretics. Francis will be evil, very probably, for as long as he breathes. Whatever evil deed he wants to do, he has abundantly showed he will do not only out of calculation but also out of a whim, out of spite, out of long held grudges, or out of pure arrogance, and there is no way we can rely on him to behave rationally.

He has his own motives in pursuing this reconciliation. We have ours. If this reconciliation is made the proper way (see above) I see no reason to refuse it.

By weary of Greeks bearing gifts. Look attentively into the horse. Then make of the horse a war machine against the Greeks.

We shall see who is smarter, who is Catholic, and who has the Lord on his side.   

M

Advertisements

Posted on February 8, 2017, in Catholicism, Conservative Catholicism, FSSPX, Traditional Catholicism and tagged . Bookmark the permalink. 21 Comments.

  1. Here is my thoughts on this subject and I am a SSPX’er. If it was a “street cred” thing, Francis would just unilaterally recognize them, like he did with the “confession” thing. Since he is not doing this, he needs them to sign something. So the game is what do they sign. But no matter what they sign, he will interpret that document just like he does Scripture. When he thinks he can get away with it.

    • If he can’t do anything after the signature, the point would not be of great import. However, the SSPX signature would allow Francis to say to the world “I am the ‘umble bringer of pacification where my predecessors were unable to have anything else than strife”. of course, this must also be the only thing the agreement allows him to do or say.

    • Could also be the case similar to the Order of Malta. If Francis gets them under the VII umbrella, he could try and pull the same number where he asks them to kindly hand over their assets. If you look at the FFI episode, the reason Francis had them crushed was that he found out that they did not have any assets. All their assets were in trusts controlled by the Faithful. With the Order of Malta, as soon as the Grand Master resigned, the Chancellor supposedly transferred all the cash to the Vatican Bank. $1b supposedly. And the Chancellor’s brother is on the board, along with our favorite FrancisCleric Msgr. Ricca.

      So the most like scenario is that Francis is angling for the SSPX’s assets. Which is why anything Bp. Fellay signs, no matter how benign, Francis and his brain trust will try to turn it against the SSPX.

    • The Order of Malta is a sovereign order. What they have done is treason. If the SSPX were as bad as them, they would hand over all their assets to Francis now, this very day.
      Goes to show that no amount of protection protects from cowardice and complicity.
      M

  2. I can’t share your optimism on this one M. We have the example of each group which got shaved off SSPX over the years, wishing to be “regularised”. With the exception of FSSP, they ALL capitulated. Campos Brasil is the most poignant example. Yes, each retains the trappings of Tradition, but they’ve all been castrated. Even FSSP is forming ‘soft’ priests who generally stuff their heads in the sand upon any mention of the bad things happening in the Vatican. I may not be able to explain it well, beyond the psychological premise that one tends not to criticise those who are “nice” to one. Yea, SSPX shall proceed like a ‘cancer’ within, and it will surely be treated as such. We all know what radical chemo eventually does…

    • If one accepted to be castrated, it means that he was a eunuch before the surgeon came.
      The FSSP has been, from the start, an outfit of V II “collaborationists” (Italo english for you) that woudl be wiped out by Francis in three seconds net if he wanted to do so. I don;t think the comparison with real tough guys is appropriate.

  3. Oh, yes, another thing.. The only structure ever mentioned regarding this regularisation was a Personal Prelature. Actually, only an idiot would hold out for any less than an Apostolic Administration, for that is the only jurisdiction which doesn’t bind to the capricious whims of territorial ordinaries. No?

    • Well I repeat myself here. Everything that dsoes not leave the SSPX in exactly the same position of autonomy (assets, money, & Co.) is very bad and must be rejected.

  4. Very interesting to read your thoughts since they’re so similar to my own! As long as the deal is far-seeing and covers every possible contingency, is rock solid and water tight, they should take a leap of faith and do the deal. I believe that the Lord who so earnestly prayed “ut unum sint” the night before He died, desires that the SSPX be intra ecclesiam rather than extra ecclesiam and will provide for their well-being and success.

  5. The entire decision rests on the points of protection for the SSPX as you’ve outlined. This is a chess game to him, so as long as the SSPX is aware of that, they may be ok.

  6. A personal prelature is not a viable canonical solution because it puts the SSPX in the hands of the local bishops. The Apostolic Administration offered by John Paul II is a better arrangement.

  7. “You bring the crowns and heads of conquered kings to my city steps, YOU INSULT MY QUEEN (!!!), you threaten my people with slavery and death….” MAN-O-DAY, Mundabor….could you have possibly found a film clip more apropos of the demonic bergoglio regime????

    OUT-FRICKIN’-STANDING!….well done fine sir.

    However, unlike you, I think that the SSPX should remain Pella….the evil clown took the head and crown of the saintly Fr. Manelli, and his sons and daughters, for being crypto-Lefebverists; his fangs are no doubt dripping blood at the very thought that he might crush the real things. I don’t think there’s a legal paper on earth that the demon infested (with enough power) can’t break to their benefit. francis will take the seminaries, the property, he’ll place the best under virtual arrest (ala Manelli), he’ll mentally torture, spiritually maim, and destroy while licking his chops. No dear friend, I think they should remain Pella…..right where they are.

    My only (and I mean ONLY) pause in this conviction is the wonder; has Fellay been given a divine presentiment?….does he know that time is coming to a close in short order, and to enter under the enemy flag might save some souls yet in the bullet-riddled barque, who would otherwise remain in francis-error and be damned? Only God knows, but that thought alone gives me great pause.

    susan

    • Ah, but you see, a Pope is bound by, say, US law just like everyone else. He can’t just go and take the SSPX seminary in Virginia. It is exactly about where his paws are allowed to strike.
      Archbishops Lefebvre could have been ordered to lock himself up in a monastery *when the SSPX was in full communion*. He would not have done it!
      Pope Francis could order the SSPX to disband *without being with them in full communion*, and if they are weak and stupid enough they could still do it!

      It takes two to tango. The agreement does not mean the SSPX will tango…

  8. Mundabor, I think that you do not WANT to see the reasons why an SSPX-heretical Rome agreement is a bad idea. You do not understand the position of Archbishop Lefebvre. How many of his writings have you read, and are familiar with?

  9. I pray that it is so. If ever the Catholic Church needed to et its house in order, it is now. I can only trace its near demise to Vatican Council II’s misinterpretations and misapplications, plus several very questionable premises put forth by the Council. Of course, historically speaking, the media’s agenda became the advancement of tearing the Church down from every angle. Our bishops permitted gross distortions to be advanced and implemented, The Church is people we were were told. Well, of course. So this meant that new church architecture had to throw everything traditional out the window.

  10. No, the SSPX should most definitely not sign any agreement with a heretic.
    Would they submit to Luther? If not, why should they submit to someone who is far less Catholic than Luther?
    Would they submit to Stalin? If not, why submit to someone less trustworthy than Stalin?

    There is absolutely no possible upside to an agreement. They already are in “full communion” with everybody that matters: all the Catholic Popes, all the Saints, going back to the Apostles and Christ Himself.

    But there is a huge possible downside to the agreement: They could lose control of their assets, in which case they would have to start from scratch, but their donors would not trust them anymore. In practice that would be the end of the resistance to modernism, because without a strong SSPX, the other “traditionalists” would be crushed very quickly.

    It might happen because of something in the agreement, or because Francis and his goons simply do not care about legality and decide to do to the SSPX what they have done to the FFI. It might happen in a hundred different ways. You may see this as very unlikely (I disagree, but let us assume that your risk assessment is correct for the sake of the argument). However unlikely it may be, it is not impossible. The risk is not zero.

    But the upside is zero. Recognition by modernists is, if anything, a net negative. Why accept even the slightest risk for no gain at all?

    You may think the horse a nice gift. You may even inspect it very thoroughly and with great suspicion. But why stake the safety of your town and the lives of your people on the assumption that the Greeks did not have one more trick up their sleeve that you did not expect? Why take the horse inside the gates at all? Simply burn it down, a safe distance away from the town, downwind, so it cannot do any harm at all.

    There is nothing to gain from letting the horse in.

    • I can’t imagine an agreement in which they lose control of their assets.

      However, consider that those who say the SSPX are perfectly fine as it is now are a minority. They would get a huge boost among conservative Catholics if there were an agreement. Mind, this is not about whether this is theologically correct or not. it’s just what would happen.

  11. Church architecture was just one of a number of denigrating changes. My geographical parish for many years looked like a high school auditorium – or high school assembly room. What’s worse from Vatican II was the change of liturgy which was slapsticky, and heavy emphasis was on the note of happy meal which was preceded by a variety of homilies, some actually good. The music was piano fed and poorly representative of the biblical readings, but with a cocktail lounge sound, particularly as accompaniment to the priest’s recitation of the Canon and Consecration. It was distracting, and that was disconcerting. The congregation of priests serving the parish began to improve some months before I moved to another area. The pastor was transferred, and some months before that an orthodox Catholic Priest who had been a high school principal was placed in the parish.

  12. In my opinion, one of the most hurtful things which occurred in the parish to which I geographically belonged was the constant assertion, implicit and explicit, of the O.S.F.S. congregation of priests, was how off base, and in error, the pre-Vatican II Church had been.. This vein of assertion was constant, and from where I had come, I received each replication of this theme as an insult. I had known for the most part only dedicated and saintly types of priests in my youth and adulthood, prior to the experience of “new church,” and now a disturbing experience for me was to find myself disliking a priest for the first time in my life, both the pastor and the curate. Something was awfully wrong, the fruits of Vatican II were manifestly on exhibition, and it was a devastating experience for me. At this point, I am an old man, and I can only hope, in memory of the Lord’s promise, that things will be rectified. I am not an SSPXer, because of non-proximity of an SSPX chapel, but I hold the SSPX as the only hope of helping the Church out of the mess in which it is. I pray for canonical recognition and regularization of the SSPX.

  13. I say these things because the orthodox bishops and priests who are in “new church” are like snow balls in hellfire. They are not strong enough to gain any momentum sufficient for saving the sinking ship. The SSPX is a God-given remnant of our Church, and with it errors of Vatican II interpretation and their application can be clarified. I reject Vatican II since some of it needs to be clarified, and because of what it has done to the church.

%d bloggers like this: